johnwang wrote:Sometime people try to find application from the forms (such as hip throw in Taiji form). IMO, this is not the right approach.
All MA systems have a finite set of "principles" that the system is built on. You should not find application from forms. You should find application from principle.
principle -> application
For example, a foot sweep principle can create more than 30 different kind of different foot sweep application. Since it's impossible to record all the foot sweep application into your forms, if you try to create application from forms, you will only create a small subset of your foot sweep principle.
What's your opinion on this?
oragami_itto wrote:Form-> application->principle
everything wrote:What is a principle of foot sweeps? I would say I'm not good at foot sweeps, but then I haven't really practiced them much.
johnwang wrote:everything wrote:What is a principle of foot sweeps? I would say I'm not good at foot sweeps, but then I haven't really practiced them much.
The principle is "push/pull head down, sweep leg off".
Your leg contact point can be:
- in front of ankle,
- foot inner edge.
The push/pull contact point can be:
- neck,
- shoulder,
- ...
The sweep contact point can be:
- ankle,
- in front of ankle.
The application can be:
1. Shoulder pulling kick – push/pull, counter itself
2. Sleeve push/pull kick – sleeve hold, or upper arm hold
3. Foot landing kick
4. Horizontal throw, heel kick – back belt right sprint, right kick
5. Neck arm kick – collar/sleeve, twist/counter twist, single neck tie
6. Neck mopping kick- spin, wheeling step
7. Elbow locking kick – counter itself
8. Arm pulling, leading leg blocking kick
9. Reverse head lock kick
10. Front waist lifting kick
11. Head leaning knee seize kick – left knee seize, right kick
12. 3 points step kick – head lock, or under hook right back spring, right kick
13. Scoop kick – mirror stance, right scoop, left kick, collar/sleeve
14. Back spring kick – right back spring, left kick
15. Side spring kick – left side spring, right kick
16. Horizontal throw, inner edge kick – back belt horizontal throw, left kick
17. ...
Again, your form may record only 1 kind of the foot sweep application. If you convert your application into your principle, how will you be able to figure out the rest of the foot sweep application?
everything wrote:Thanks. I don't know those, but it's easy to follow after reading your principle first. Definitely.
Yes, this is totally correct. However, it is mentally exhausting and very difficult to sustain if you are practicing the form like 10 times in a rowRon Panunto wrote:It's important to visualize an application for each posture in the form. The yi (intention) drives the movement. If you're not intending an application with each posture then you may as well be dancing.
Ron Panunto wrote:The Taiji principle of "foot sweep" is Lieh, i.e., splitting (application of force in two different directions at the same time).
johnwang wrote:Ron Panunto wrote:The Taiji principle of "foot sweep" is Lieh, i.e., splitting (application of force in two different directions at the same time).
Do you have any clip to prove that sweep is a Taiji principle? The reason that I ask because the sweep has to train from "shin bite". From
1. shin bite - 45 degree downward force.
you then extend to
2. scoop - horizontal force.
3. sticky lift - vertical upward force.
4. sweep - 45 degree upward force.
It's 4 in 1 package. You cannot train sweep alone. We may get into a deep level of CMA discussion. This make CMA interested.
johnwang wrote:Ron Panunto wrote:The Taiji principle of "foot sweep" is Lieh, i.e., splitting (application of force in two different directions at the same time).
Do you have any clip to prove that sweep is a Taiji principle?
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