modern aikido

[emptycloud]

Thats great news, no effort needed, just couple of seminars here and there and bingo instant aiki power.

Shit why didn't you say it was so easy. You been holding out on us man. I thought Dans shit was hard graft.

Why didn't you say it earlier, I have been working my ass off, holding down a job, family life, keeping social commitments, cramming the practice in when ever possible.

Shit man, no sweat you say, just tuck it in 5 minutes at the end of the day, a little hip wiggle here, little number 8 there. Jobs done.

Jeez, I have been breaking my balls..

where do I sign up for easy street.. I'm convinced.

Time and commitments not an obstacle to extraordinary aiki development... sign me up buddy..

If your recommended training regime can slice a few hours off my practice schedule I will pay for that hooch brother.. cos time is a precious commodity round here.

The less time I gotta sweat my nuts off with the chi gung & the neo post-modern aikido-esque lite crowd the better..

You don't need much time you say to get this aiki shit down...your not lying now, I can trust you...?

[Bodywork]

Rich
Continually posting like a twelve year old doesn't establish any credible position or forward a paticular view. It does you a disservice. Can you do any better than this? If not, I am content to continue to use your posts as a spring board to forward more relavent talking points to a wider audience. Just don't confuse the intent. I have no interest in talking - with you- in the majority of my posts.

[emptycloud]

Rich
Continually posting like a twelve year old doesn't establish any credible position or forward a paticular view. It does you a disservice. Can you do any better than this? If not, I am content to continue to use your posts as a spring board to forward more relavent talking points to a wider audience. Just don't confuse the intent. I have no interest in talking - with you- in the majority of my posts.

So you would agree that for middle aged men/women with families,demanding careers and social life, they will find that time is an obstacle in achieving high level skills at say aikido or tai chi or internal power training. Not impossible, but time and sweat, is a big factor in learning anything.

Is what you teach different. Mark seemed to think the time/sweat/tears/blood equation was a false, proven in the 1930's even.
That time constraint is not a problem to achieving excellence.

I would say time is the key ingredient.

can I have my lollypop now please..

Rich...(still wallpaper stripping - karate kid style)

[Aqui]

Seriously guys, this thead goes nowhere...

It's more than obvious, that emptycloud is a troll, that gets off on engaging serious martial artists like Dan and Mark in stupid Internet discussions!

My advice to Dan and Mark (and every serious martial artist ) is to
a) leave this thread and
b) delete all previous posts

Trolls lile emptycloud don't deserve any attention, at least not from qualified teachers or serious martial artists.

Sorry emptycloud, but your behaviour is just plain stupid.

Aqui

[emptycloud]

Seriously guys, this thead goes nowhere...

It's more than obvious, that emptycloud is a troll, that gets off on engaging serious martial artists like Dan and Mark in stupid Internet discussions!

My advice to Dan and Mark (and every serious martial artist ) is to
a) leave this thread and
b) delete all previous posts

Trolls lile emptycloud don't deserve any attention, at least not from qualified teachers or serious martial artists.

Sorry emptycloud, but your behaviour is just plain stupid.

Aqui

Its going somewhere and trolling I can assure you it is not.

Here we have a discussion which began as an exploration of modern aikido and attracted the attention aiki power purveyors.

That I am not ass tight serious about the subject, is not trolling.

That I have been raising issues of practice & context and the mythologising of Ueshiba is not trolling.

That we are discussing fundamental truths to any form of expertise is obvious.

your sincerely

Rich

ps you didn't do Dan or Mark any mental favours with your comments..

[Dmitri]

My advice to Dan and Mark ... delete all previous posts

That wouldn't achieve anything at all...

What might be helpful instead, if an admin who has a bit of spare time (and maybe even some interest in the subject matter, e.g. maybe Tom?) would carve out some of the very informative posts into a separate thread, with an appropriate title (e.g. Ueshiba's Aikido or something along those lines) so that all that cool info doesn't get lost in the rest of the irrelevant noise here...

[emptycloud]

any translators, kinda speaks for itself I guess.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UBaxEwy5tmA

[Aqui]

My advice to Dan and Mark ... delete all previous posts

That wouldn't achieve anything at all...

What might be helpful instead, if an admin who has a bit of spare time (and maybe even some interest in the subject matter, e.g. maybe Tom?) would carve out some of the very informative posts into a separate thread, with an appropriate title (e.g. Ueshiba's Aikido or something along those lines) so that all that cool info doesn't get lost in the rest of the irrelevant noise here...

Hey Dimitri, I agree an Admin taking Dan's , Mark's and all other substantial posts and putting them in a new thread would be the best idea, the info is just too valuable to be lost. Then emptycloud can rant for himself here.
The reason I suggested to delete the posts was simply, because guys like emptycloud (just like stalkers ) feed on every reaction they get so the only way dealing with them is ignoring them and leaving them alone...

Best,

Aqui

[WVMark]

Rich
Continually posting like a twelve year old doesn't establish any credible position or forward a paticular view. It does you a disservice. Can you do any better than this? If not, I am content to continue to use your posts as a spring board to forward more relavent talking points to a wider audience. Just don't confuse the intent. I have no interest in talking - with you- in the majority of my posts.

So you would agree that for middle aged men/women with families,demanding careers and social life, they will find that time is an obstacle in achieving high level skills at say aikido or tai chi or internal power training. Not impossible, but time and sweat, is a big factor in learning anything.

Is what you teach different. Mark seemed to think the time/sweat/tears/blood equation was a false, proven in the 1930's even.
That time constraint is not a problem to achieving excellence.

I would say time is the key ingredient.

can I have my lollypop now please..

Rich...(still wallpaper stripping - karate kid style)

It seems like you have a Modern Aikido mind set. That it's about going to the dojo and training seriously to get better. Putting in extra days training. That's the technique oriented approach.

Ueshiba, Sagawa, Horikawa, Tokimune, and Hisa had solo training regimens which were critical to aiki. Some talked about them generally. Most kept them secret. But it was training one could do anywhere.

Sure, time is required. But even busy, middle aged family men/women can progress with the solo training.

Ueshiba's training was very different than Modern Aikido training.

[Bodywork]

Well, I consider the sum total value of Rich's posts to be zero. He hasn't offered anything substantive, informative, or analysis of either method.

I consider the topic to have value for people trying to consider the differences between modern aikido and Ueshiba's aikido.

[Bodywork]

Rich
Continually posting like a twelve year old doesn't establish any credible position or forward a paticular view. It does you a disservice. Can you do any better than this? If not, I am content to continue to use your posts as a spring board to forward more relavent talking points to a wider audience. Just don't confuse the intent. I have no interest in talking - with you- in the majority of my posts.

So you would agree that for middle aged men/women with families,demanding careers and social life, they will find that time is an obstacle in achieving high level skills at say aikido or tai chi or internal power training. Not impossible, but time and sweat, is a big factor in learning anything.

Is what you teach different. Mark seemed to think the time/sweat/tears/blood equation was a false, proven in the 1930's even.
That time constraint is not a problem to achieving excellence.
I would say time is the key ingredient.
can I have my lollypop now please..
Rich...(still wallpaper stripping - karate kid style)

It seems like you have a Modern Aikido mind set. That it's about going to the dojo and training seriously to get better. Putting in extra days training. That's the technique oriented approach.
Ueshiba, Sagawa, Horikawa, Tokimune, and Hisa had solo training regimens which were critical to aiki. Some talked about them generally. Most kept them secret. But it was training one could do anywhere.
Sure, time is required. But even busy, middle aged family men/women can progress with the solo training.
Ueshiba's training was very different than Modern Aikido training.

Hi Mark
Rich's argument style is like this:
Mark: Healthy grass is green
Rich: can't you see that in a post modern world people don't have time to walk to the movies?

Now, away from Rich, your point is spot on. All of the worlds higher level arts have solo training for direct purposes. For those who don't know what the hell they are doing, and yet are trying to learn aiki?
Sagawa's quote says it the best.
"Aiki is training the body. Only amateurs think you can lean aiki from techniques." (now insert 95% of aiki people...and Rich, arguing with Sagawa's opinions).

My personal favorite is
People talk
You shugyo
Years go by
People still talking
Then you get up to demonstrate
Then everyone knows the truth

Jakes favorite is
baka-ni tsukeru kusuru-wa nai.

[emptycloud]

Rich
Continually posting like a twelve year old doesn't establish any credible position or forward a paticular view. It does you a disservice. Can you do any better than this? If not, I am content to continue to use your posts as a spring board to forward more relavent talking points to a wider audience. Just don't confuse the intent. I have no interest in talking - with you- in the majority of my posts.

So you would agree that for middle aged men/women with families,demanding careers and social life, they will find that time is an obstacle in achieving high level skills at say aikido or tai chi or internal power training. Not impossible, but time and sweat, is a big factor in learning anything.

Is what you teach different. Mark seemed to think the time/sweat/tears/blood equation was a false, proven in the 1930's even.
That time constraint is not a problem to achieving excellence.

I would say time is the key ingredient.

can I have my lollypop now please..

Rich...(still wallpaper stripping - karate kid style)

It seems like you have a Modern Aikido mind set. That it's about going to the dojo and training seriously to get better. Putting in extra days training. That's the technique oriented approach.

Ueshiba, Sagawa, Horikawa, Tokimune, and Hisa had solo training regimens which were critical to aiki. Some talked about them generally. Most kept them secret. But it was training one could do anywhere.

Sure, time is required. But even busy, middle aged family men/women can progress with the solo training.

Ueshiba's training was very different than Modern Aikido training.

I do solo training daily, its essential. I only have two group classes a week. As I have mentioned many times before, we do not study technique at our club or have grades.

I have a read Sagawas writings and that of his students. There is some good stuff and some tall tales..
What comes through from Sagawa and Ueshiba is that their immense physical regimes cannot be separated from there exceptional skill. How we square and hack this in our modern world is the obstacle.

[Bodywork]

Rich
You do not know what to practice in solo training or what you are doing to make the aiki the founder talked about.
As I said though; That's perfectly fine. It's what modern aikido actually ...is. Aikido without aiki.

[emptycloud]

The main solo training I was taught is a subtle figure of 8 movement deep within the hips and at the classic hara point.

This is a circular stepping form of moving chi gung. The figure of eight movement organises the rest of the body, Its difficult put into words.

If you look back you will see I have outlined my training methods over and over again.

What kind of solo training do you guys do, seen as we are sharing.