Wu Baji Dispute

[BajiFreak]

"taekwondo champion's slayer" is a pretty comical way of describing things. It looked to me more like a typical friendly exchange like you see at most seminars. Hardly any sort of a challange match. Even Wu Lianzhi says in the clip that they just exchanged a few techniques. (我跟他过了四招，只四下。）

This what i said to my good friend BajiRao in our previous lengthy exchanges. In 2005 I was at WLZ's home when he showed me the DVD he had about that event. I told him this was not a real fight for me. He said that it was just a friendly sparring (although the guy was there to test him a bit) and he was himself joking about the video. Then CCTV used the event to promote CMA and added a bit of drama to it ... Nothing new under the sun ...

Main problem is that the event was then translated in the chinese press as "Chinese MA smashed Korean TKD" or something like this (I haven't seen the press release myself, so I can"t say ...), but this is the way things usually go in China : media control, nationalism etc. lead to this kind of things regularly, it'sbeen like that since a long time ago. Just get over it and learn how to decode what chinese media and chinese people say. Usually, taking the logarithm of what is reported works well . Also,it is always better to ask people directly, especially in the case of WLZ, there is usually a huge gap between what he says, and what people say that he says ...

[Andy_S]

The "Baji vs TKD Fight" is from a Korean TV series of about a decade ago about the guy in the clip who travels around Korea and meets various MA masters. Some he learns from; some he exchanges techniques with (eg in the above clip); and some he actually gets a fairly serious kicking from (Taekyun and Kyokushin, IIRC).

So this was from a documentary TV show, it was in no way a match or a challenge...as is pretty clear to anyone watching the clip.

AFAIK, the TKD guy was neither a champion nor a master, though was a pretty decent 2 or 3 dan who came up with a pretty decent concept for a TV show in the days before Discovery and Nat Geo came along with "Fight Quest," etc.

[Baji Rao]

http://tieba.baidu.com/p/2579734823

[Overlord]

經審判委員會討論判決如下：
一、被告吳金光立即停止對原告的侵權行為，並自行銷毀其
所有光盤。
二、駁回原告對其餘四被告的訴訟請求。
三、駁回原告的其他訴訟請求。
原告是輸家！孟村法院在五個被告中僅支持一個被告，而且這一被告吳金光先生 ​​僅僅多說了一句話《不是人》，法院僅給原告吳連枝的一個《下台階》而已。
..........................................................................................................................................................................................
From the video evidence given by my friend, it shows that Wu Zhong was born and buried in Qing Yun.

However, this does not mean Wu Lianzhi has poor Baji skills or his Baji is not from Wu Zhong.
In fact he was the first ones promote Baji, making it known globally and more popular and open.

Over

[Baji Rao]

"taekwondo champion's slayer" is a pretty comical way of describing things. It looked to me more like a typical friendly exchange like you see at most seminars. Hardly any sort of a challange match. Even Wu Lianzhi says in the clip that they just exchanged a few techniques. (我跟他过了四招，只四下。）

This what i said to my good friend BajiRao in our previous lengthy exchanges. In 2005 I was at WLZ's home when he showed me the DVD he had about that event. I told him this was not a real fight for me. He said that it was just a friendly sparring (although the guy was there to test him a bit) and he was himself joking about the video. Then CCTV used the event to promote CMA and added a bit of drama to it ... Nothing new under the sun ...

Main problem is that the event was then translated in the chinese press as "Chinese MA smashed Korean TKD" or something like this (I haven't seen the press release myself, so I can"t say ...), but this is the way things usually go in China : media control, nationalism etc. lead to this kind of things regularly, it'sbeen like that since a long time ago. Just get over it and learn how to decode what chinese media and chinese people say. Usually, taking the logarithm of what is reported works well . Also,it is always better to ask people directly, especially in the case of WLZ, there is usually a huge gap between what he says, and what people say that he says ...

I'm sure this story has also been reported on the documents for the "Intangible Cultural Heritage" (非物质文化遗产),"Cangzhou Wushu - Mengcun Bajiquan". Now can this story be considered true? Is this history facts?

http://baike.baidu.com/view/5181299.htm
2002年，吴连枝受韩国弟子邀请，到汉城八极拳武馆讲学。当时有人向吴连枝提出同韩国跆拳道高手较量的要求，一位六旬的老人去较量一个26岁的年轻人，大家都为吴连枝捏了把汗。没想到二人仅过了四招，韩国青年竟被摔倒四次。

[Baji Rao]

經審判委員會討論判決如下：
一、被告吳金光立即停止對原告的侵權行為，並自行銷毀其
所有光盤。
二、駁回原告對其餘四被告的訴訟請求。
三、駁回原告的其他訴訟請求。
原告是輸家！孟村法院在五個被告中僅支持一個被告，而且這一被告吳金光先生 ​​僅僅多說了一句話《不是人》，法院僅給原告吳連枝的一個《下台階》而已。
..........................................................................................................................................................................................
From the video evidence given by my friend, it shows that Wu Zhong was born and buried in Qing Yun.

However, this does not mean Wu Lianzhi has poor Baji skills or his Baji is not from Wu Zhong.
In fact he was the first ones promote Baji, making it known globally and more popular and open.

Over

Maybe...or maybe not. I don't want to hurt anybody so I won't say anything else, good baji practice to anyone

[BajiFreak]

And anyway, this verdict is already outdated : the Wu have gone for appeal at the CangZhou court. There will be another trial ...

[Overlord]

And anyway, this verdict is already outdated : the Wu have gone for appeal at the CangZhou court. There will be another trial ...

Wow, still going?
Seriously dude, the whole dispute had been going on since 1930s.

Now, in Chinese Kungfu-pedia,【 中國功夫辭典】 published in 1987, the dispute was recorded under Ding Qingpu 【丁清普 】on page 5. According to its account, Ding also had disagreement with Wu Huiqing 【吳會清】as early as 1937 in 【verification 】 of Wu style baji manual. Later, it is said Ding returned Mengcun teaching the 【old frame】 baji after retirement.

I guess Wu Lianzhi will just re-appeal as many times as till he wins.
I

[BajiFreak]

Wow, still going?
Seriously dude, the whole dispute had been going on since 1930s.

Now, in Chinese Kungfu-pedia,【 中國功夫辭典】 published in 1987, the dispute was recorded under Ding Qingpu 【丁清普 】on page 5. According to its account, Ding also had disagreement with Wu Huiqing 【吳會清】as early as 1937 in 【verification 】 of Wu style baji manual. Later, it is said Ding returned Mengcun teaching the 【old frame】 baji after retirement.

Even much earlier than the 30s... Chinese proverb : "Erveytime someones want to write a Quanpu, shit happens ..."

I guess Wu Lianzhi will just re-appeal as many times as till he wins.
I

I personnaly also think this is a waste of time, money and energy, since both parties will probably lodge appeals endlessly. Only their lawyers will benefit from this situation ...

[Andy_S]

RE: "TKD champion fight"
Actually, this was from a Korean TV series about MA: It features this young chap who travels around Korean learning from and sparring with various martial arts masters. I guess he learned of the Baji guy during a visit to Korea. (FYI, this segment was filmed in the park near World Cup Stadium where I occasionally train myself). Pretty good series, on the whole: There are chunks of it on YouTube, but AFAIK, the series has not been translated or subbed into English.

But:

"TKD champion?"
I don't think so, though he is pretty decent at sportive TKD - probably 2nd or 3rd dan.

"FIght?"
Not really - more a light spar/technical exchange, in this case. And it was for a TV show, after all, so they wanted to see technique.

However, some of the guys he spars with in the series DO, in fact, give him a bit of a kicking: The episodes on Taekkyun - he got KOed by an spinning elbow to the head (after the guy had just jump spin-kicked him by running up a tree, IIRC!) - and on Kyokushin - he got spanked with lots of heavy leg kicks and body punches by a large and rather unkind Kyokushin bruiser - were the most entertaining.

And in the Taiji episode, needless to say, he got pushed back ... again and again and again and again ... by the Hanbit Taiji master who is widely seen on Youtube and who was, I would guess, about a foot taller than the TKD lad and about twice his weight.