Trip wrote:Trick wrote:any yang taiji fast form most probably came around -
1 : from students seeing the masters personal spontaneously freestyling the traditional form, and then tried as best they could to recreate into a formalized exercise what they seen...
The Fast Sets, Long Boxing, ext., are old Taiji Fight training methods that were Passed on.
Yang Chengfu’s Older Family members, Uncles, Older brother, practiced these methods.Yang Shaohou, Yang Chengfu's older brother, learnt some of his skills from his uncle Yang Banhou. His Taiji high "frame" had lively footwork and small movements, alternating quick with slow actions. He was swift and powerful in delivering his blows roaring and howling as he darted back and forth.
The techniques of his Taiji were: overcoming strong attacks with soft movements, adapting oneself to others' movements and following up with quick attacks, using the motion of "sudden connection" to defeat the opponent with surprise attacks. The hand movements included catching, pushing and capturing, injuring the attacker's muscles and harming his bones, attacking the opponent's vital points and "controlling" his arteries and veins, using "continuous" and "sudden connection" force to throw the attacker to the ground with lightning speed.
They are not made up or died out; the are passed on.
Yang Chengfu passed these Taiji Training methods on to his disciples, Chen Wei-ming, Tung Ying-chieh, etc.
Yang Chengfu passed it on his son, Yang Sau Chung, and he passed it to his children. His children still teach it to their Taiji students today.
Some of their students are members of RSF."When he (Yang Chengfu) gave demonstrations" during his early days in Shanghai, which was setup by his disciple Chen Weiming, Chengfu performed the movements of kicking with speed and force. Later, however, to suit the needs of treating chronic disease, he changed them into slow movements with inner exertion of force. And in such movements as punching downward and punching the opponent's pubic region, he only made imitations instead of manifest exertions of force, thus making the set of movements continuous and evenly paced."
Gu Liu Xin, in his introduction to 'Yang style Taijiquan' by Yang Zhen Duo
Though, Chengfu took them out for treating disease,
The Yang Style Taiji that Tung Ying-chieh passed down to his children and their families
still retain many of the old training methods like Rapid Kicks, etc.,
in their Tradition Yang Style Taiji
Those old Yang Style Training methods,
informs all the Taiji they do.
Those old Taiji Training methods are in the Fast Sets
Just like sparring,
Taiji fast form, Long Boxing, are Shadowboxing that
can help Taiji Students increase accuracy,
form, technique, footwork and prepare them for real fights.
Fast sets do not take the place the slow set;
they are another Tool in the Taiji Training Toolbox.
So, do the fast sets or don’t, it’s up to you.
yes ive heard and read all about that long time ago.
that the longfist exercise should be a specific fighting exercise more than the authentic taijiquan form just does not make sence.
longfist execise are of couse the beginner exercise for the totally untrained youngsters. someting all/most of the yang family members and guangfu village members went through doing at a young age, then when old and robust enough they began doing taijiquan.
swift footwork and quick hands expressed during taiji practice comes naturally with longtime correct authentic ”slow” form practice.
if such hasnt come forth, then one have to just continue practising the aithentic taijiquan form...patience.