A word about speed

Discussion on the three big Chinese internals, Yiquan, Bajiquan, Piguazhang and other similar styles.

Re: A word about speed

Postby Strange on Sat Oct 17, 2015 5:35 pm

Bhassler
that's the problem.
you need me to write logically, but the Way out of this "problem" cannot be solved by logic
you cannot "brain" yourself out of this thingy.

this world is run by economic "thinking", just look around you at the environment mang.
and ppl tell you they come up with real innovative stuff all the time
cos they are uneducated and unlearned and they think what they do is real clever.

my word of caution here is to tell all that what you do is to your own body
no one can replace it if you damage it with "smart", "innovative", "looks real cool", "feels like a man" techniques.
this is not being more "martial", this is damaging to your "martial"

now once again, with feeling, say "I must understand"

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Re: A word about speed

Postby MaartenSFS on Sat Oct 17, 2015 6:08 pm

johnwang wrote:Some TCMA systems such as the 字门(Ziman) and the praying mantis do require the speed training to the maximum. The 字门(Ziman) system has a training called 通三关/丢三关 (go through 3 joints) that you train how to let your Qi (energy) to go through your shoulder joint, elbow joint, wrist joint, and then reach to your finger tips (used for finger tips strike).

You stay in horse stance and

- drop your right hand on the left side of your left knee (loose shoulder joint),
- swing your right hand in front of your chest (loose elbow joint),
- swing your right hand 45 degree to your right (loose wrist joint).

You then move your left arm and repeat this drill as many as you want. When you can move both of your arms so fast that you can't even be able to see your own arms, you are truly Sung and fast.

I know I always say that I can't watch the videos here in China, but I am intrigued to see what this drill looks like. Is it 抡臂? The way that I have been taught doesn't really use the wrists that much, though, just the entire arm and loosening the shoulders. We have separate drills for the elbows and wrists. I will say, though, that this drill has improved my Gongfu so much that it's crazy.
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Re: A word about speed

Postby MaartenSFS on Sat Oct 17, 2015 6:09 pm

Oh, and Strange... keep being... strange. Loving it. ;D
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Re: A word about speed

Postby johnwang on Sat Oct 17, 2015 8:29 pm

MaartenSFS wrote: Is it 抡臂?

You can call that 抡臂. When you can feel wind moving around your body and you can't even see your own arms, you may get some speed developed in your body. This training is much more difficult than the praying mantis training that you jump up in the air, throw 3 punches, before land back down.

One day one Zimen guy challenged the 8 step praying mantis GM 魏笑堂 (Wei Shao Tang). The Zimen guy bowed to GM Wei, stepped in, attacked his finger tips on Wei's chest, stepped back, and left. That was how fast that Zimen guy was. Did the Zimen guy's finger tips striking hurt GM Wei? May be not. If the Zimen guy held a dagger, could the Zimen guy kill GM Wei? May be he could.
Last edited by johnwang on Sat Oct 17, 2015 8:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: A word about speed

Postby Overlord on Sun Oct 18, 2015 2:23 am

Hi Kenneth, thanks for your reply.

Now let us have a look about this news, I am just surprised to see it.
http://filmcombatsyndicate.blogspot.com.au/2015/04/la-coroner-confirms-darren-shahalvis.html

Considering Strange's comment, it is good to rethink.
Yeah.....perhaps genetics, but then again both of actor's parents may still be alive. :-\
Last edited by Overlord on Sun Oct 18, 2015 2:27 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: A word about speed

Postby Bao on Sun Oct 18, 2015 2:36 am

MaartenSFS wrote:I know I always say that I can't watch the videos here in China,


OT question, but do you have an iPad?
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Re: A word about speed

Postby kenneth fish on Sun Oct 18, 2015 10:21 am

Overlord:

I am not sure how Strange's comments relate to that actor's death. As a physician (D.O. and D.C.) I do not find the coroners report shocking or unusual, save for the fact that it went undetected. Considering the reported degree of occlusion I would have expected the patient to have complained of angina-like chest pain. Genetically determined lipid abnormalities and cardiovascular disease are not terribly uncommon in pediatric populations (leading to adult ASVD) and it is not unusual that the susceptibility would not be reflected in the parents.
Last edited by kenneth fish on Sun Oct 18, 2015 7:19 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: A word about speed

Postby Strange on Mon Oct 19, 2015 5:48 am

my job is to tender for public contracts.
before the fact, everyone listens to what i say and nobody says anything.
after the fact, when tender bids are published
you see suddenly everyone becomes a genius with a complete theory that explains why the tender results are the way they are.

when i ask, why did you not say anything before the fact? you could have saved us all a whole lot of trouble.
no one can say anything.

....and before you know it, the man is dead.

very quickly, you learn all the after the fact theories in the world combined is not worth a nano second of insight before the fact.
Last edited by Strange on Mon Oct 19, 2015 5:56 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: A word about speed

Postby kenneth fish on Mon Oct 19, 2015 7:34 am

Back to the subject of the OP.

I am a reasonably fast puncher (one of my students, Forrest Chang, once described sparring with me as "like walking into a blender"). I will likely be in Singapore next year. Strange, I believe that is where you hail from? If so, would you be willing to show me how you use slow training to deal with a fast punch?
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Re: A word about speed

Postby Strange on Mon Oct 19, 2015 7:51 am

we can meet up, no problem
but are you angry?
i think you are very much missing the point.

i am sure you would not have any problem, i'm the slowest in my teacher's class :)
let me know when you have your flight confirmed
Last edited by Strange on Mon Oct 19, 2015 7:54 am, edited 3 times in total.
天官指星 单对月 风摆荷叶 影成双

岳武穆王以枪为拳, 六合形意李门世根, 形意拳五行为先, 论身法六合为首,少揽闲事心田静, 多读拳谱武艺精 - 李洛能 (形意拳谱)
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Re: A word about speed

Postby kenneth fish on Mon Oct 19, 2015 8:01 am

No, not angry - I would like to see you demonstrate what you claim. What I propose is:

We stand facing each other within arm's reach. I will indicate where I will strike. Then, without any cue, I will punch. I am curious to see how you block or evade a fast punch without having trained to do so. This will also test your reaction time and awareness (as I will not be giving cues as to when I will punch nor telegraphing my punch).

This is actually a drill we do in both Xingyi and Tongbei (although I think it may have come from Tongbei).
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Re: A word about speed

Postby kenneth fish on Mon Oct 19, 2015 8:04 am

I try to return to Taiwan every year to see my family and pay my respects at the graves and temples where my family members and friends who have passed are interred. Then I usually spend the rest of my trip travelling with my eldest daughter. We are currently trying to decide between Vietnam and Singapore, neither of which I have been to since the 1970's. I will keep you informed of my plans. Until then, as far as I am concerned, this topic is done for the time being.
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Re: A word about speed

Postby Strange on Mon Oct 19, 2015 8:07 am

i see, it is very interesting.
and as you know very well, my training only deals with slow punches, not fast ones.
like i said, let me know when you have your flight confirmed
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Re: A word about speed

Postby chud on Mon Oct 19, 2015 1:06 pm



kenneth fish wrote: As a physician (D.O. and D.C.) I do not find the coroners report shocking or unusual, save for the fact that it went undetected. Considering the reported degree of occlusion I would have expected the patient to have complained of angina-like chest pain.


My cousin died just a few months ago from the same thing (heart attack due to blockage of L.A.D. or left anterior descending artery) - it is commonly known as "The Widowmaker" and it is not uncommon for otherwise healthy young people to die suddenly from it, with no warning.
Some people are lucky enough to show symptoms before hand and get to an E.R., but many don't.
I highly recommend that all forum members watch this excellent documentary to see what I mean:
http://widowmakerthemovie.com/
I also recommend that everyone get a CT Scan with Calcium Score (they are non-invasive, quick, easy, and cheap). The Calcium CT Scan is the best method right now to detect this - it would have saved my cousin's life.
Last edited by chud on Mon Oct 19, 2015 1:56 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: A word about speed

Postby kenneth fish on Mon Oct 19, 2015 1:15 pm

Excellent information.
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